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March 14, 2005 Planning Board Meeting
Chairman Larry Ruth called the meeting to order at 7:35 PM. Members present were Gene Bavis, Elaine Leasure, Larry Ruth, Pat Stark and Peter Schillaci. Also present were Paul Russell, Phil Williamson, Dick Morris, Norm Druschel and Supervisor Guelli.
Gene Bavis made a motion, seconded by Elaine Leasure to dispense with reading of the legal notice. Motion carried.
Elaine Leasure made a motion, seconded by Peter Schillaci to approve the minutes of February 23, 2005 as presented. Motion carried.
1. Application of Gregory Matzan for preliminary and final approval for modification to previously approved site plan for property located at 4855 Arbor Road. Property is zoned RR-2.
Greg Matzan was present and stated that he would like the site plan revised allowing the side setback to the north to be 21’ in lieu of 35’.
Paul Russell, Town Engineer, stated that from an engineering standpoint the plan was deficient in that it didn’t provide drainage swales on the applicant’s property. The applicant stated that the plan would be corrected to show proper drainage. When the drainage swales are shown, the plan will conform to the engineering requirements.
Chairman Ruth questioned the size of the garage. Greg stated that the garage would be 24’ wide x 22.8’ deep, providing a 2-car capacity. Dick Morris concurred that the size of the garage would provide a 2-car garage capacity.
Gene Bavis questioned the drainage on the north side of the property as it relates to the neighbors. Paul Russell stated there is a low spot north of the applicant’s property that appears lower then the applicant’s property. If the project site includes proper drainage swales to deal with its own drainage, it would meet Town Standards. The drainage from the applicant’s site would not add to the drainage problems to the north of the applicant’s property.
Gene Bavis questioned if the roadside drainage issues were being worked out. Paul Russell stated that there has been discussion between the two towns and both towns have obligations to deal with drainage.
Chairman Ruth opened the meeting to the public.
Ted Watts – 4877 Arbor Road
Mr. Watts questioned if the placement on the applicant’s lot would be further north of the previous plan. Mr. Watts stated that, if the applicant had made the people aware of the change in the side setback a few months ago, there would have been more focus on moving the building further south.
Mr. Watts stated that the drainage in the area is a huge concern. The whole area is low, however, the lowest area is where the previous basement has been filled. Greg Matzan responded that they are going to direct all water to the front ditch. The parcel has good pitch, but there will be a need for some fill. Mr. Watts further stated that there is a culvert under the road, however, there is no ditch to the north, so he questioned whether the water would drain to the south or north.
Paul Russell stated that the contour plan shows the drainage is to the south. With the contour plan being the only information Paul has at this time, he cannot visually tell if the water will go north. Mr. Watts stated he expects quite a bit of the water will go north.
Chairman Ruth questioned what progress there has been with trying to get the two towns to work out the drainage issues. Paul stated that there have been discussions between the towns of Walworth and Marion. The land is in the Town of Walworth. The two Highway Superintendents have to get together and work out the drainage issues.
Rick Nudd – 4897 Arbor Road
Mr. Nudd stated that he is less effected then the Watts. At the December Planning Board meeting there was assurance by one of the Planning Board members that this building would not be back in for another variance. According to Board minutes, the town has paid the builder $11,000 to move the house from its original site. The builder has moved the house giving him the chance to move the side setback to comply with the original site plan. Mr. Nudd would like to see the Planning Board not grant another variance and hold him to the original site plan.
Peter Schillaci explained that the builder was not present to request a variance, as a variance is granted by the Zoning Board of Appeals, not a Planning Board. Peter Schillaci further stated that the garage is being constructed in compliance with the required side setback and is actually farther then the setback requires.
Dick Morris, Attorney for the Town, stated that the applicant has the right to request a modification from the original site plan. One of the main reasons the applicant is again requesting a modification is because the problem with the low spot in the land where the driveway was proposed.
Chairman Ruth stated the original issue was that the house did not have the proper front setback from the road. Dick Morris stated that the previous application considered by the Board was for the front setback only, and has been taken care of.
Chairman Ruth explained that when the original application was before the Board there was no mention by the applicant of changing any other dimensions on the property. After the Board required the 125’ front setback, it was discovered that the plan would have to be modified to allow placement of the driveway.
Mr. Nudd stated that he understood what Chairman Ruth was saying, however, he still would like the Board to stick to what was stated at the December Planning Board. At the January meeting Mr. Matzan had pulled his application because the town had already come to an agreement with him, therefore the application was not discussed.
Greg Matzan stated at the time of the original application the Board was not aware of any further changes being made to the site plan. Mr. Nudd responded that Mr. Matzan was at the December meeting when the remark was made that the original site plan be followed, which would include the 35’ side setback. Chairman Ruth responded that since the Board dealt with the front setback only the other dimensions were not addressed. After the foundation was filled in and the location of the structure moved, Mr. Matzan wanted to reroute the driveway due to the settlement of the land, therefore he has requested a modification.
Chairman Ruth stated that Mr. Nudd was correct in what he stated. The guarantee made at the December meeting is in fact a guarantee that shouldn’t have made, as the Board did not explore the other setbacks. Chairman Ruth further stated that any person that comes before the Board has the right to come back and request a modification. Then it’s the Board’s decision if the approval will be granted.
Dick Morris stated that the Board’s comment was based on the plan before them at that time. The Board informed the applicant he had to comply with the original plan, but that doesn’t prelude the applicant from requesting a modification to the plan. This is entirely a separate application and a separate public hearing. The statute as it existed, as it was advertised and as it was granted complied with the plan. As long as there is compliance with the setback requirements, and not in violation of any of the Local Law, a modification can be requested.
Gene Bavis stated that the statement was based on discussion; not motions. Discussions are open discussions and there was not an overall agreement amongst the Board and there was not a motion made.
Chairman Ruth stated that it is not unusual for applicants to request modifications to the original plan.
Mr. Nudd stated it was still his opinion that the applicant should be kept to the 35’ side setback.
Susan Watts – 4877 Arbor Road
Mrs. Watts questioned how the applicant was going to build other than a 2-car garage when deed restrictions specified a 2-car garage and how close the turnaround and driveway would be located to her property.
Chairman Ruth stated that being the applicant is going to build a 2-car garage the question is a mute point. After reviewing the site plan it was determined the turnaround would be 8’ off the property line.
Gene Bavis made a motion, seconded by Peter Schillaci to close the public hearing. Motion carried.
Gene Bavis made a motion, seconded by Elaine Leasure to approve the amended site plan, subject to the engineering issues being resolved with the Town Engineer.
Roll Vote: Gene Bavis Aye Elaine Leasure Aye Larry Ruth Aye Pat Stark Aye Peter Schillaci Aye
Motion carried.
2. Application of Walworth Sportsman’s Club, Inc. for modification of previously approved Special Use Permit located at 4247 Ontario Center Road. Property is zoned RR-2.
Robert Acquilano, Secretary of the Walworth Sportsman’s Club was present and explained the Club is seeking approval for modification to the existing Special Use Permit. The modification will allow the Sportsman’s Club to open on Wednesday from 11 AM to 9 PM.
Chairman Ruth questioned if the additional day was the only modification being requested. Mr. Acquilano stated this was the only modification. Basically, there are a number of retired members that would utilize the Club in the afternoons and make it possible for people who work until 4 or 5 PM to shoot up until 9 PM.
Chairman Ruth questioned if the 9 PM time would be year round or just during longer daylight hours. Mr. Acquilano stated for the purpose of this application it would be year round.
The club was founded in 1959 and moved to the Walworth location in 1962. It was originally under the name of the Penfield Gun Club, Inc., the Walworth Gun Club, Inc. and most recently the Walworth Sportsman’s Club, Inc.
Gene Bavis stated that currently the approved days for shooting are Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Gene Bavis questioned if all of the days were currently being used. Mr. Acquilano stated currently the days used are Saturday and Sunday. However, once the weather improves, the club will also be open on Friday. Shooting activity declines in November. Gene Bavis explained that he was trying to determine the amount of activity.
Chairman Ruth stated that he had received a petition with approximately 14 signatures on it. After quick review it appeared the signatures on the current petition are primarily located north of the Sportsman’s Club.
Chairman Ruth stated that the records on the Sportsman’s Club are limited and indicates there is only input from the1990’s. Mr. Acquilano stated there are shooting events in the late spring, summer and fall. Most events are on Saturday or Sunday. The Special Use Permit outlines the hours that shooting is allowed and they try to adhere to the specified hours. The level of activity has been constant over the years and during the fall and winter months the shooting activity does decline. During the summer months the shooting is done by 8 or 9 PM.
Pat Stark questioned if there were any activities offered other then shoots. Mr. Acquilano stated there is a clubhouse, pool table, and a scholastic shooting group for high schoolers. The club has approximately 90 members with approximately 50 members from the Walworth area. The club does have a liquor license.
Mr. Acquilano stated a competitive shoot will include approximately 50 people and will generally be completed by 2 or 3 PM. On a typical day, when there is not a scheduled shoot, there could be 20-30 members. The club is limited to shot gun only. The range is directed to the north of the club.
Chairman Ruth stated he is aware that the Ontario and Williamson club are not restricted on days of operation. However, neither club is located in a residential area.
Chairman Ruth opened the meeting to the public.
Evelyn Bowen – 4305 Ontario Center Road
Mrs. Bowen stated that her and her husband had submitted the petition and the signatures represent the neighbors whose property abuts the gun club. Mrs. Bowen stated that Mr. Burger and Mr. Villnave both own a Right of Way to the gun club. Mrs. Bowen questioned if there are 90 members of the Sportsman’s Club why only 50 members are involved in shooting events. Mr. Acquilano stated that not all of the members are shooters. Mrs. Bowen further questioned if there is a membership list. Gene Bavis stated that it is a bonified organization that owns the property and has the right to use the property under the terms of the Special Use Permit and why would it matter if there is a membership list. Mrs. Bowen stated a membership list would verify if there are 50 members from Walworth. Mrs. Bowen stated the gun club was there prior to the area becoming as residential as it is today. Since then there is a Town Code, Chapter 108-1, against loud noises. Mrs. Bowen doesn’t see how the town could approve this modification because it would be against the Town Code. Chairman Ruth stated it is a pre-existing condition from 1960 with no restriction on days or hours.
Dick Morris stated under 180-43 C the provision under the Nonconforming Use section of the Code could possibly be apropos to this situation. The reason being is that under the provisions of Section 180-11, which deals with the RR-2 Zoning District, there is no permitted use today in our Local Law for an entity such as a gun club. Previously there was a provision in the law that allowed a gun club to operate with a Special Use Permit. After reviewing Chapter 180-43 C Dick stated the use of the land can’t be increased or intensified. Dick stated that more facts of the history of the gun club would have to be reviewed.
Chairman Ruth stated that his recollection is that in the mid 1990’s during a reorganization of the Club there had not been any Special Use Permit issued. When the Club name changed, the Club was required to come before the Board and that is when the Special Use Permit restrictions were imposed.
Mrs. Bowen asked if any traps had been added since the Special Use Permit was issued. A representative from the Gun Club responded that there had not been any traps added, although they would like to add some.
The neighbors hadn’t complained because they have to abide by the law too. With the addition of Wednesday, there would be more days of shooting then there are quiet days. On the days that there are special shoots the hours are not from 10 AM to 4 PM, they are earlier. The only time Mrs. Bowen has called the gun club is when there is shooting earlier than 10 AM, at which time she was advised there was a special shoot.
Bonnie Tucker-Mongeon – 4320 Downs Road
Mrs. Tucker-Mongeon stated her property abuts to the back of the gun club property. She stated she was happy to deal with Friday, Saturday and Sunday – it’s part of the neighborhood ,but she is against adding an additional 10-hour day. The amount of time is excessive and is too late at night. When gardening and/or entertaining she can clearly hear any noise from the gun club. It’s not only a disturbance outside but also inside. She wants the record to state she is against the additional 10 hours every week.
David Wilbert – 4418 Ontario Center Road
Mr. Wilbert stated that prior to the issuance of the Special Use Permit the Gun Club were not very good neighbors, but since that time they have been living within their rules. Mr. Wilbert stated that he has been willed a packet of information about the Gun Club and would be happy to give it to the members to see if it could help determine some history.
Frank Guelli – 4459 Ontario Center Road
Mr. Guelli stated he has been a resident of Walworth for over 35 years and was a member of the gun club in the early 1970’s. The shooting was only on weekends in the 1970’s. The Club was allowed under a Special Use Permit, however, if you applied for a Special Use Permit today, it wouldn’t be allowed to operate.
Mr. Guelli stated that he didn’t want to belabor whether the gun club is in harmony with the neighborhood, but as part of the application for the Special Use Permit submitted on 10-26-95 under item C1, “the applicant alleges that the proposed Special Permit use: 1. “would be in harmony with the character of the neighborhood because we have been in this location for the past 35 years 2. and that it would not be detrimental to the property or persons in the neighborhood because we are not asking to extend our hours or expand our operation, only continue as we have been.”
Mr. Guelli has no problem with the hours continuing on Friday, Saturday and Sunday but there is a problem with them starting on Wednesday. If they want to be in harmony and keep the neighbors happy, they should continue with the hours they currently have.
Mr. Acquilano stated he has been a member for the past 4 or 5 years and the club has made an effort to comply with the Special Use Permit requirements. The Club would appreciate consideration of the application. Any information the club could provide regarding the history of the club, and how they have operated since the 1960’s, would be gladly provided and every effort to work with the neighbors will be made.
Chuck Allen – Penfield, New York
Mr. Allen stated that he is the President of the Sportsman’s Club and a member of the original Gun Club started near Salt Road in Penfield.
The intent of opening on Wednesday is to help the Ontario club, and develop a league between Walworth and Ontario. It is possible that the Wednesday hours could be modified from 1 PM to sunset. The additional day is to help the gun club generate more revenue so the club can help support the community.
Mr. Allen can understand the concern of the neighbors, but it is a recreation enjoyed by the members of the Club. Mr. Allen has recently taken the President position and has presented the idea to the Club of going to the neighbors to invite them to the Club Championship shoot for a cookout. By doing that it would give the neighbors the opportunity to see what the Club is about. There is a scholastic shooting program where students from Wayne Central come to shoot competitively.
Mr. Allen stated that guns can be dangerous, however, they’re only as dangerous as the person is pulling the trigger. There are stupid people that have to use a gun as an instrument and ruin the sport for the people who enjoy it.
Evelyn Bowen – 4305 Ontario Center Road
Mrs. Bowen questioned if persons other then members were allowed to shoot at the Club. Mr. Allen explained that they host ATA shoots, which are competitive shoots and one of the biggest shoots of the year. There are non-members allowed to shoot other then at competitive shoots, however, they must come with a member, pay an additional fee and sign in with the Club.
Gene Bavis stated that the Special Use Permit does not state you have to be a member to shoot at the club.
Chairman Ruth questioned what restrictions the Club had with regard to gun safety. Mr. Allen stated that they do have not any restrictions, but safety is not taken lightly. If the rules of play are not followed, your membership could be terminated.
Pat Stark made a motion, seconded by Peter Schillaci to table the application until the April 11, 2005 Planning Board meeting to allow the Attorney for the Town time to review the information on file. Motion carried.
1. Application of Timothy P. Dippel, Executor for the Estate of Florence Dippel, for preliminary and final approval for two-lot subdivision located at 4995 Ontario Center Road approximately 1/10 mile South of Plank Road. Property is zoned RR-1.
Cynthia Kukuvka, Attorney for the Estate of Florence Dippel, was present and stated Tim Dippel is the Executor of the estate and had come to a previous Worksession at which point there was some information requested, including the Abstract of Title. At that point in time Mr. Dippel had been looking at the fact that the Town was in the process of changing the acreage requirement from 2 acres to 1 acre. The subdivision will divide a 1-acre parcel off thecurrent 53.20-acre parcel. The remaining acreage will be left in the name of the estate to be addressed later with the Board.
Peter Schillaci questioned if all setbacks would be met. Cynthia Kukuvka stated that with regard to the frame barn, there was an agreement entered into between Ken Dippel and Andrew Dippel acknowledging that the frame barn encroaches on Ken’s land. The agreement was the barn could remain in its current location, it could be repaired but could not replaced, should it be taken down. There is a deed restriction that states if the property is transferred, the new owner would be bound by the deed restrictions.
Gene Bavis questioned if the barn listed as “frame barn with collapsed roof” had been repaired as the new map indicates “frame barn”. Cynthia Kukuvka stated the barn is the same barn and has not been repaired.
Peter Schillaci further questioned the encroachment of Ken’s driveway on Andy’s property. Cynthia Kukuvka stated the driveway did not encroach on Andy’s property. At one time Ken’s driveway also serviced the log house but has been subdivided off. The area of the driveway that shows the encroachment is not used, it is basically just hard packed and Andy has been advised to put dirt down and plant it to grass.
Chairman Ruth questioned if Phil Williamson was satisfied with the arrangement being made regarding the “frame barn”. Phil stated it is not an issue, in his opinion.
Chairman Ruth opened the public hearing.
There was no public comment.
Peter Schillaci made a motion, seconded by Elaine Leasure to close the public hearing.
Motion carried.
Gene Bavis made a motion, seconded by Peter Schillaci to approve the revised 2-lot subdivision per the map prepared by Robert F. Morris III, PLS, dated 11/29/04 with revision date 2/9/05.
Roll Vote: Gene Bavis Aye Elaine Leasure Aye Larry Ruth Aye Pat Stark Aye Peter Schillaci Aye
Motion carried.
Chariman Ruth adjourned the meeting at 9:04 PM.
Karen Ambroz, Clerk |